SUV lift system

[Brett Proctor]

Doesn't seem like much discussion is happening tonight so I thought I'd throw this out there for discussion.

I might go to the junk yard tomorrow and I was putting together a list of things to look for. One was the hydraulic system out of a convertible for lifting the canopy when a light flickered and I was wondering if the system used to lift those heavy tail gates on SUV's would work. I have no idea how the system works so I don't know whats involved in it but if it lifts that heavy rear door then lifting a fiberglass canopy would be a piece of cake for it to lift.

Is it a hydraulic system or electric and would it work in our cars, how compact is it???*hmmm*
I'll find out tomorrow whats involved in it but I thought I'd see what everyone else has to say about it.

 

[ydeardorff]

Ive seen some for minivans. Depends on the model I suppose. Ive seen cable operated systems, and hydraulic.
Sorry not much help there.

 

[Brett Proctor]

Not much input going on here.
I guess everyone has gone to bed

I would think that the canopy being so lite compared to the SUV's tail gate it would lift the canopy in no time,plus I read some systems you can control the height

 

[letterman7]

Never seen a hydraulic setup for a tailgate, Brett, other than the pneumatic rams usually attached. Total canopy weight with glass is somewhere around 200 pounds; I can't say that a lift gate is that much, but then, I've never had one off, either. Keep us posted.. could be interesting!

 

[GS Guy]

Our old Caravan used a combination of pneumatic self contained "gas spring" cylinders and a (mostly hidden) lever-type system to lift the powered rear gate. Since the gas spring cylinders were fully capable of lifting and holding the gate up by themselves, I don't think the power lift system had or needed all that much strength to "lift" the gate.
Seems like a combination like that could be used on a Sterling too - pneumatuic springs carrying most of the weight and light-duty hydraulics or other actuators to create the motion?
Jeff

 

[Brett Proctor]

One of the things that peaked my interest in this system is you can open the back door with the switch or you can open it manually. Don't know if all manufacturers have this setup. Something to look into. Seems that this would resolve some issues that some of you face when the battery goes dead and you have no power to the hydraulic pump to lift the canopy.

 

[islandman]

I have an electric lift on my Toyota Estima MPV rear door. As you say I can choose to lift via a switch or manually. I guess the key part to this system is the final closure and locking. Basically the lifting arm mechanism closes the door pretty much all the way, then a lock solenoid seems to take over and pull it tight the last 1 cm. it’s this same solenoid which gets released when you open it manually.

So I guess to work on a Nova / Sterling this additional locking mechanism (probably two required, one each side) would have to be incorporated in addition to the lifting actuator.

 

[ydeardorff]

sounds very much like the Cadillac system for its trunk. That grab and pull closed feature is on their big cars.

From experience in driving my sterling around, having a positive locking system for the canopy should be a consideration while driving. My top was only held in place by the hinges, and some gas struts, and it was all over the place while driving. The nice thing about a cable operated system is it would give the installer more flexibility in the install location.

 

[Brett Proctor]

Came up empty today looking for one of these systems.

I'll keep looking and when I find one I'll post my findings

 

[mud4fun]

I will try to remember to take pictures and get part numbers for what we install on the Sorrento. The are electric/air and can be manually lifted and lowered as well as electric. They have stop switches mounted on the tg that shut off the cylinders when fully closed. Not in my shop but I will go out to assembly repair to get pics.

 

[mud4fun]

Our lift cylinders are made by Brose in Germany. I looked at their website and they do make multiple components. Just need to find out where to buy them from.
Systems for liftgates | Brose Fahrzeugteile
20 inches long but only a 4 inch stroke. Could work for Cimbria doors if mounted correctly to get the right angle. It had 7 wires running to the motor.

 

[Brett Proctor]

While at the pick a part yard today I looked at the convertible car systems.
99% were gone from the cars.
I did come across one that was still intact. It had an electric motor for raising and lowering the top. The thing that caught my attention was it had an over ride switch for the system. So you could raise and lower the top manually if needed.

 

[ydeardorff]

Hmm, interesting. Its similar to a power window actuator. I wonder how strong it would be?

 

[Brett Proctor]

Hmm, interesting. Its similar to a power window actuator. I wonder how strong it would be?

Strong enough to raise and lower the top by itself. Saw only one motor in the system. Looked at the schematics and found only one motor pictured.

I may go back tomorrow and check it out alittle closer.

By changing the gearing you can regulate how fast it opens and closes the canopy.

 

[Brett Proctor]

Been researching this and it looks like it's not worth the effort.

The system has a control module and is tied into different systems of the car for it to work.

The module monitors many different inputs and outputs such as door lock status,
transmission gear selector position and vehicle speed.

The module also contains the software technology to detect liftgate obstructions and stop and/or reverse the door accordingly.

If you start taking away inputs that its suppose to receive no telling if it will work right.

Well it sounded like a good idea.*idea didn't work*

 

[Brett Proctor]

Since nobody is posting I thought I'd resurrect this post and shed some light of any progress on it.

Got an email from a ex member asking about getting one of these for them so they can experiment with it and see how plausible it was to make it work in the sterling.

The SUV that the mechanism was in requires only one to open and close the back hatch and the size has gotten smaller as technology has progressed.

I may also play with this also. With this setup the unit was design to do this and not something else that has been modified, so it should last and safety features are all ready built into it.

I'll see if I can find any wiring diagrams on it and see whats all involved in the system.

 

[Brett Proctor]

??

 

[Brett Proctor]

Took the plunge and got one of these.

Preliminary tests(not by me) show that the unit has promise.

The real selling point of this for me is that, not only does it have the power to do the job but it has a disengage feature so you can bypass the unit and open or close the canopy manually if needed.
The disengage feature doesn't require a whole lot of effort to use either.

More info as I find out more

 

[Brett Proctor]

Been researching this and it looks like it's not worth the effort.

The system has a control module and is tied into different systems of the car for it to work.

The module monitors many different inputs and outputs such as door lock status,
transmission gear selector position and vehicle speed.

The module also contains the software technology to detect liftgate obstructions and stop and/or reverse the door accordingly.

If you start taking away inputs that its suppose to receive no telling if it will work right.

Well it sounded like a good idea.*idea didn't work*

Thought I'd update this post.

The unit that I was looking at when I made this comment had CAN BUS network attached to it.

The unit I have now doesn't.

 

[Brett Proctor]

The disengage feature doesn't require a whole lot of effort to use either.

More info as I find out more

Starting to focus my efforts on this now

Been going over the wiring diagram for it and I see some bad and good.

The bad is it uses serial data line to operate, they call it PCI. This is just about the same system thats in the climate controls. I'll see whats involved and decide if I'll keep it or go with a different way to operate the system

The good is the disengage feature is controlled by a solenoid. So right now it looks like by installing a switch to control the solenoid is all thats required to go from power lift to manual lift.