Manual R&P

[Brett Proctor]

Found this today
Couldn't resist getting it

I'll get some dimensions on it later for you

Its out of a 1987 chevy Sprint

 

[Brett Proctor]

Did some research on this unit and here's what I found out.

Although its in good shape and can be used, parts are no longer being made for it. At least from the dealer so I feel like I've wasted $35.

If it ever needed to get rebuilt I'm not sure the parts are out there to do it.

 

[Peter]

Shouldn't worry too much Brett, the chance of the rack or pinion needing replacement is remote and the things that do wear such as end bushes and seals can be got anywhere or made.

Nice neat unit and those long rods look easy to trim down and thread to get the approximate 110CM (43.3") needed for VW , (at least that's what mine measures).

 

[Brett Proctor]

From my findings while going through the wrecking yards, all of the Geo Metro's have this unit in them also.at least it looks the same. never pulled it to check all of the dimensions just a visual.
I also came across a Metro with a power steering unit in it but never pulled it to see if it has the same dimensions as the manual unit because I already have the power rack and pinion that I'm going to install and this didn't look to offer any benefits from what I already have.

So for those looking to upgrade your steering I've given you three choices to get you started in the right direction.

Once I get my power rack and pinion installed I'll know for sure if the inner and outer tie rods I found will work. These will require no modifications for them to fit. Everything will bolt together

 

[Peter]

What pump have you decided on, remote electric like the Mercedes/Porsche/VW one?

 

[Brett Proctor]

What pump have you decided on, remote electric like the Mercedes/Porsche/VW one?

Since I have a Subaru EJ25D motor in the car I'll stay with the stock power steering pump that came with the motor.

Mounts are all there and all I have to do is run the lines to the rack and pinion.

 

[letterman7]

IIRC, a manual steering rack from a early (1980's) VW Rabbit will mount right in a Beetle framehead with the appropriate mounts, and the rod-ends are the same at the Beetle, with the same "reach".

 

[Brett Proctor]

After doing a little research I found out that the manual rack and pinion in the Rabbit is the same manual unit that the VW Cabriolet uses.

The only thing that I see that will be an issue is getting a inner tie rod thats the right length.

The manual unit uses a 22X1.50R threads at the rack and pinion. There are not that many inner tie rods with that thread.

Length of the Rabbit inner tie rod is 13.21" so it would need to be cut to the right length and re-threaded.

However the VW Cabriolet power rack and pinion uses 14-1.50 threads at the rack and pinion which is easier to find the right length with no cutting involved. There is more of a selection of inner tie rods with the 14-1.50 thread than with the 22X1.50R threads

The inner tie rod I have selected has a length of 9.94"(EV192)
This inner tie rod will also fit the manual rack and pinion unit mentioned in this post.

The outer tie rod that Rick mentioned should fit with no issues. Its real close to having the same taper fit as the bug but its not the unit I decided to use. I decided to use an outer tie rod with an offset to it to allow for more clearance at the inner tie rod pivot point so as the inner tie rod moves through its travel there is less chance of it binding.
I can't recall the part number right now but if anyone is interested let me know and I'll dig it up.

In my journeys through the yards I never came across a Rabbit or a Cabriolet manual rack and pinion but its good to know that there's another option out there that can be used.

Finding a set of inner tie rods that will work(with out cutting and having the right threads) was the biggest problem. I went through numerous inner tie rods before I settled for the ones I have.

 

[Brett Proctor]

From my findings while going through the wrecking yards, all of the Geo Metro's have this unit in them also.at least it looks the same. never pulled it to check all of the dimensions just a visual.

Well since this post was started Things have changed a little.
I now find myself needing a manual rack and pinion instead of a power unit.

I found out there is a difference between the Geo Metro and the Chevy Sprint.

Even though they look the same the length is different.

This is a rack and pinion out of a 91-96*hmmm* Geo Metro(94 to be precise). It is a little shorter in length than the Chevy Sprint and just for curiosity I looked at a 2000 Metro to see if it was the same.

Even though they all look the same the length is different. The 2000 Metro was longer.

This unit has a very low profile that helps make it a good choice, because once it clears the center tunnel the connection point is just about at the right height for where the steering column comes through the fire wall.
To bad the mounts aren't closer together. Maybe there's a solution to that.

 

[islandman]

To bad the mounts aren't closer together. Maybe there's a solution to that.

View attachment 8242

Don't make the mistake I did and go for solid mounts. I tried several, rubber, urethane and then eventually solid aluminium mounts. They worked for a while but all the vibration and kickback from the wheels goes and eventually wears the interference fit joint between the outer steel stube and cast aluminium pinion section. All because I didn't do the mount properly in the first place.

So I fixed that and I'm back to runner mounts and the feel is so much better

 

[Peter]

Good point, I am sure my Citroen C15 unit is bolted directly to the bracket so I might look into fitting some grommets to the mounting bolt holes.*insane*

 

[Brett Proctor]

Don't make the mistake I did and go for solid mounts. I tried several, rubber, urethane and then eventually solid aluminium mounts. They worked for a while but all the vibration and kickback from the wheels goes and eventually wears the interference fit joint between the outer steel stube and cast aluminium pinion section. All because I didn't do the mount properly in the first place.

So I fixed that and I'm back to runner mounts and the feel is so much better

I was going to find a mount like this one and then locate it in the desired position.

This mount is from the power VW unit that I have. The tube diameter is bigger than the Metro unit so I would have to locate one with the correct diameter to fit over the Metro's tube



Here's a better view of the dimension at the pinion section.

 

[Brett Proctor]

Rebuilt the Geo Metro unit yesterday and couldn't believe how simple and easy it was to take apart and rebuild. Only 2 seals in the whole unit. One for the shaft and an o'ring for the cap.

New bellows should be here this week. Got those from Rockauto. Prices range from $9-$20 depending on quality.

I'm starting to really like how easy this install will be. No hydraulic lines to run, no power steering pump to install, one less belt to run off the engine to the pump, Just two wires to the EPAS and the low profile of the rack and pinion unit should fit with no hassles. and you can find inner and outer tie rods that will work so there is no cutting and rethreading of the old inner tie rods.

So watch this come back and bite me*laugh**yipes*

 

[islandman]

one less belt to run off the engine to the pump,

And don't forget to add to the list of benefits a few more horses coming out of the engine with no hydraulic pump

and you can find inner and outer tie rods that will work so there is no cutting and rethreading of the old inner tie rods.

Now that one really really surprises me, correct length tie rods that take the right taper track rod ends on an R&P for a beetle with no cutting and welding (which is an MOT no no), well done! *thumbs up*

 

[Brett Proctor]

Don't make the mistake I did and go for solid mounts. I tried several, rubber, urethane and then eventually solid aluminium mounts. They worked for a while but all the vibration and kickback from the wheels goes and eventually wears the interference fit joint between the outer steel stube and cast aluminium pinion section. All because I didn't do the mount properly in the first place.

So I fixed that and I'm back to runner mounts and the feel is so much better

After giving it some thought I decided not to move the mounting brackets.

On the plus side(maybe) I also removed the stock mounts from the donor car thinking it would make it easier to install the unit in the sterling. Took about 30 minutes to drill out the spot welds. Of course the engine was already out of the donor car which made it easier. I don't think it could have been done if the engine was still in the car